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By all these lovely tokens
September days are here,
With summer’s best of weather
And autumn’s best of cheer.

Helen Hunt Jackson - September
The breezes taste
Of apple peel.
The air is full
Of smells to feel-
Ripe fruit, old footballs,
Burning brush,
New books, erasers,
Chalk, and such.
The bee, his hive,
Well-honeyed hum,
And Mother cuts
Chrysanthemums.
Like plates washed clean
With suds, the days
Are polished with
A morning haze.

John Updike, September
Learn English in September

Is cultural knowledge more important than language skills?

2

Comments

  • mheredgemheredge Posts: 44,774 ✭✭✭✭
    The problem with this @GemmaRowlands is that no one really wants to work in shops any more much in the UK ( and probably most rich countries), so immigrants end up in these jobs, on very low salaries where they are exploited - while at the same time there are unemployed youngsters who prefer to stay out of work than work as a very low paid shop worker.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @mheredge, I haven't seen any immigrants in the supermarket next to my house but there are quite a few new faces very often. I guess young people give up such a job easily. But I have read that they are better paid now.
  • mheredgemheredge Posts: 44,774 ✭✭✭✭
    In Nice I see mostly French people working in the supermarkets and cafés @Xanthippe but in the UK, hardly ever do I see Brits in these jobs, though maybe I'm just not seeing them. Actually this is quite true, as I do see more much older British workers in the supermarkets and shops, probably as a result of the risemail in the age of retirement.
  • GemmaRowlandsGemmaRowlands Moderator Posts: 10,331 mod
    mheredge said:

    The problem with this @GemmaRowlands is that no one really wants to work in shops any more much in the UK ( and probably most rich countries), so immigrants end up in these jobs, on very low salaries where they are exploited - while at the same time there are unemployed youngsters who prefer to stay out of work than work as a very low paid shop worker.

    That's true. I guess there is something wrong with the system where people would be better off not working, but it has been like that for a while now.
  • ech0panditech0pandit Posts: 349 ✭✭✭
    I really don't think that you can survive easily without native language , I mean if you know local language you will blend in more easily, for example, here at my place some of the people don't know the local language and they have to face a lot of discrimination, it is like they become a center of attraction which ends up mostly in negative ways.Then they have to adapt to the local language and culture, and not to forget that even though English is spoken in many areas but still there are huge amount of people who prefer to speak in their native language. for example, sometimes while playing multiplayer games I came across many people and most of them know English but they start making fun of other people who can't talk in their native language.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @ech0pandit, that's true. English knowledge is usually sufficient for tourists' needs.
  • mheredgemheredge Posts: 44,774 ✭✭✭✭
    I think it depends on where you are @ech0pandit. In cities and places where a lot of people speak English, you can get away with not knowing much of the local language but in some countries and usually in the less urban areas, it's a lot more difficult.
  • ech0panditech0pandit Posts: 349 ✭✭✭
    @mheredge , I gave that point a thought , that is why I stated that people really don't need to be from an urban area to be miserable, not pointing out really but , some of the people or rather many tend to make fun out of the guys who aren't in majority , I think that's everywhere in the world
  • mheredgemheredge Posts: 44,774 ✭✭✭✭
    It's maybe more of a problem with young people @ech0pandit but even I sometimes hear people mimic my accent when I'm speaking French and I speak the language well. But it's all in fun and I never take it seriously. The best thing is to join in with the laughter.
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    edited June 2018
    In my opinion, learning some simple local sentences is necessary, in some remote areas local people do not know how to speak English, even the most common one, under that circumstances, communication in English seems to be impossible, therefore, it maybe eccential to know some dialects.

    By the way, Arabic people are curious about foreigners, I do not know the reason, especially the children boys, they prefer to touch or talk with foreign females, which I hate very much.I suffer several time of unhappy experiences during my working period in Libya and Algeria, and one of my male colleagues even quarreled with local boys in Libya because he stopped us and continued speaking some unsuitable words and actions to us.
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    @GemmaRowlands What I dislike is working during weekend or beyong working hours, but it seems that we do not have more choices, every week we just have one day as our rest day, perhaps we have been used to it. What a horrible thing is like this, we can or do not want to fight for our rights. Huge population is a main reason, jobs are limited but people are numerous.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @lisa, I guess this is because boys and girls are kept separately. In Iraq there was another problem: young men needed a lot of money to marry and they couldn't afford it very often.
    That said, I have wonderful memories of my two stays in Iraq. I really liked locals. Some of them even wanted to marry me (ha I was a small girl at the time).

    I have just read that private small grocery shops are rather losing because of new regulations. Hm...

    @lisa, yeah, I think working during weekends is OK as long as you have free time on other days. :(
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    Algerian boys have to pay a great deal of money to marry, besides money, they have to buy a flat or a house, and a car, I think, the same for Liyan men as well. In fact, males in China have to confront the same problem, maybe worse than other countries. @Xanthippe
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Lisa, this is the same problem then. I have also read that there are too few marriageable ladies in China (and in India).
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    Actually there are plenty of marriageable ladies in China, especially in metropolis, such as Beijing, Shanghai, Shenzhen and ect, I have two classmates whose ages are the same with me, but they do not even have boyfriends, and they have been working in Beijing for nearly ten years, they are reluctant to leave there, what is worse, there are not suitable jobs in their hometowns, as far as I know, Chinese ladies who are living in countryside are not very difficult to get married, but the divorce rates are increasing, females especially those whose educational levels are higher (post-graduates, doctors) are very hard to find suitable partners. @Xanthippe
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Lisa, this is my source: wykop.pl/ramka/4296255/chiny-i-indie-maja-gigantyczny-problem-brakuje-kobiet-dla-70-milionow-mezczyzn/

    But I have no doubts that your information is more precise. :) Our journalists' knowledge is very often superficial. :(
    Typically, it is not easy for a well educated lady to find a suitable partner.
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    @Xanthippe :# I only can understand English and Chinese, it does not matter and your journalists are right on some extent, because ladies are much easier to get married, compared with men, especially in the countrysides.

    On of main reasons for ladies living and working in metropolis who are hard to find their partners is that they do not have many opportunities to meet suitable guys due to their working fields and most of them spend their most time in the workplaces.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @lisa, oh Polish is not popular at all. Don't worry. :) I only sent it because of numbers: ladies missing for 70 million men.

    I think there is a similar problem here: I have quite a lot of friends who are single. And well educated of course.
    Ha ha I am single too. :)
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    I am so lucky because my husband wants to get married with me, hahaha, or I am single now. @Xanthippe
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @lisa, but if he is already your husband how can he wish to marry you?
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    He wanted to get married with me in 2011, sorry :# @Xanthippe
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Lisa, I got it. :)
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    I just finished my listening dictation of today, and I feel a bit headache,dizzy, nausea and sleepy. @Xanthippe
  • GemmaRowlandsGemmaRowlands Moderator Posts: 10,331 mod
    lisa said:

    @GemmaRowlands What I dislike is working during weekend or beyong working hours, but it seems that we do not have more choices, every week we just have one day as our rest day, perhaps we have been used to it. What a horrible thing is like this, we can or do not want to fight for our rights. Huge population is a main reason, jobs are limited but people are numerous.

    I guess you are lucky to have a job if that's the case, although I do understand the frustration when it might not always be as good as you had hoped.
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    @GemmaRowlands Ideas are fat but reality is slim, I have to say like this. In our country our resources are not enough, but our population is too enough to have enough job opportunities for everyone.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @lisa, here societies are ageing but there is competition too: quite a lot of foreigners working for much less.
  • lisalisa Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭
    @Xanthippe In fact aging problem is gernal one throughout the whole world, the price of workforce is increasing in China in recent years, that is why the prices of commodities are expensive now although the qualities are not guaranteed.

    Ironically, government encourages citizens give birth of their second children, but the authority does not supply any contigent facilities, such as milk power which is very very expensive in China, but the quality is just so so, educational problems, and so on. The expense of rearing children is shooting up and most families can not afford to the education of two children.
  • XanthippeXanthippe Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Lisa, here families are given 500 zl for each child except for the first. However, inflation has been much higher since Law and Justice (the governing party) won elections. This is why I am not sure if the child benefit was a good idea: families have more money but this money is worth less. :( We will see.

    That said, exorbitant costs of raising children are a real problem. :(

    https://justaskpoland.com/polish-child-benefit-rodzina-500-plus/
  • mheredgemheredge Posts: 44,774 ✭✭✭✭
    This is the same problem as in the UK @Xanthippe. Many women find that there's no point working as they can get more from benefits when they have several children.
  • GemmaRowlandsGemmaRowlands Moderator Posts: 10,331 mod
    lisa said:

    @GemmaRowlands Ideas are fat but reality is slim, I have to say like this. In our country our resources are not enough, but our population is too enough to have enough job opportunities for everyone.

    That is true, but I think so many jobs can be done automatically now, there are lots of human jobs that have been lost.
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